BNC Text JT4

John Ruskin Sixth Form College: lecture. Sample containing about 11898 words speech recorded in educational context

11 speakers recorded by respondent number C601

PS4T1 X m (No name, age unknown, tutor) unspecified
PS4T2 X m (Martin, age unknown, sound recordist) unspecified
PS4T3 X f (Jo, age unknown, student) unspecified
PS4T4 X f (Vicky, age unknown, student) unspecified
PS4T5 X f (Lynn, age unknown, student) unspecified
PS4T6 X m (Darren, age unknown, student) unspecified
PS4T7 X m (David, age unknown, student) unspecified
PS4T8 X m (Assa, age unknown, student) unspecified
PS4T9 X f (Hannah, age unknown, student) unspecified
JT4PSUNK (respondent W0000) X u (Unknown speaker, age unknown) other
JT4PSUGP (respondent W000M) X u (Group of unknown speakers, age unknown) other

1 recordings

  1. Tape 124001 recorded on 1994-02-07. LocationGreater London: Croydon ( Classroom ) Activity: Lecture

Undivided text

Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1] [clears throat] Right, any comments, then on on this [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [2] No, I thought it was alright.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [3] Thank you. [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [4] Yeah, that's fine.
[5] Yes, works quite well.
[6] I thought it was quite funny as well. [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [7] Er, do you think the language is actually the language that [...] would use.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [8] Yeah.
[9] I I've used, in my script I've used a very loose language, like [...] er, very, er, well, non-standard English then, because they now, [...] erm, you know, [...] especially after having it banned.
[10] [...] my experience.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [11] So do you think this is loose enough, though.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [12] Yeah, this is fine.
[13] [...] you know, I think there's erm room for like, people being able to make up bits as well.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [14] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [15] Not [...] like, [...] you're not, it's not the way they s , like, phrase it, [...] put a sentence together.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [16] No.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [17] As the way they're saying [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [18] To be quite honest man, I've never really, never really did see a problem.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [19] If they're gonna be that type of band, they're not gonna be, thinking as how they pronounce a sentence.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [20] Is that [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [21] How they've portrayed a excellent ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [22] [...] It's like in in in in in interviews as well, like you don't,som some people do but, if somebody asks you a question, you just try and answer it, you don't really think about, erm, the way you construct everything.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [23] No.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [24] Isn't this ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [25] No. [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [26] A lot of these people [...] English.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [27] Yeah but.
[28] Isn't this ... isn't this language a bit stereotypical of the band?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [29] It doesn't really matter who that is. [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [30] I feel like
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [31] It's true but ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [32] If they, if they can't speak properly, they haven't got much chance of writing a song.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [33] I mean [...] some lyrics are pretty inane, aren't they.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [34] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [35] It's
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [36] I think they're clever. [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [37] Well, they're clever in one respect, but they're not necessarily clever with words.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [38] Yeah, well some of, some people can't really er, communicate, can't converse with er, people in normal conversation, but, er, when it comes to writing stuff down, you know, they can be very good.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [39] Or they can converse in a sense that they can get a chord progression or a melody together that actually works, and says something, irregardless of the words.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [40] Exactly.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [41] The words are often the last thing that, or sometimes the last thing that people actually write.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [42] And this, I mean, this isn't meant to be a good band anyway, is it?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [43] Is that [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [44] The fact that they can't communicate, or they don't speak, or whatever, is something to do with.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [45] I suppose [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [46] Yeah, but just because they're a rubbish band, doesn't mean that they can't communicate, and that's sort of the image that we're portraying here.
[47] Or isn't that bit [...] s s stereotypical.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [48] So, so what.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [49] What's the matter with words [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [50] I don't know, I just think, I just think
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [51] What's the problem.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [52] No, there's no problem, I'm just like, saying that, they sound really thick, they're rubbish ... at being in a band, and it's just all so down-hill for them from the beginning, really, they didn't really have a chance, did they.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [53] Exactly.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [54] Exactly.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [55] [...] gotta have high hopes to start with.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [56] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [57] But they don't that.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [58] [...] have high hopes.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [59] Yeah, but they they just are are, they're just rubbish.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [60] You know, they just, they they just not fated to be in a band, at all.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [61] No.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [62] Have you seen the Graham Taylor documentary?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [63] [laughing] He had to bring football into it didn't he? []
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [64] Well, it's it's not exactly football it's just like a tragic downful slide, isn't it.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [65] Er, I just think that th the the language is a bit too, sort of, proper, and that, you know, they have, you know.
[66] He couldn't play the drums, he was too loud, that sounds too formal ... you know, say, he was crap at the drums, couldn't they,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [67] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [68] or, [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [69] [...] what would they say these days about you know the drum.
[70] I mean, in in, sort of colloquial language,wh what would they say.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [71] I think, you'd be surprised [...] here, I do, with how the bands speak at like, especially on a rockumentary on T V.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [72] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [73] [...] you wouldn't think that they were a band like, you can tell they were on drugs, some of them.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [74] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [75] The way they speak, you wouldn't.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [76] So their language isn't ... basic.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [77] No, it just terrible, no.
[78] You know, there's ever hardly ever any swearing [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [79] They're probably not allowed to show it, are they.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [80] Exactly, they're not, they wan they're being interviewed for television, they can't be probably their normal selves, can they.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [81] Well, that's what this is, isn't it.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [82] Exactly, same as ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [83] All ages.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [84] Yeah well of course.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [85] Famous people, you'd be surprised, people just erm, switch into a different like, mode, when they're being ... erm, filmed for, you know, cameras and everything.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [86] Or recorded.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [87] Exactly.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [88] So the they got to erm, watch everything they say. ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [89] Do you reckon that er, word at the [...] top there,incon incompatibility
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [90] Is that is that the kind of word that you would use about er
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [91] That would be used by the interviewer.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [92] Would there be an official reason.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [93] What.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [94] Are there usually official reasons [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [95] Well, I heard a lot of peoples ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [96] Got bored with being together.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [97] Sorry.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [98] They become bored with being together.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [99] They just, [...] if they,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [100] if they don't get on,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [101] give up [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [102] Exactly, they're incompatible.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [103] Mm.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [104] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [105] This is, whether it's the word they'd use, or whether
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [106] Yeah, but they wouldn't use it, their manager or something like that, would say [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [107] Their agent.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [108] Their agent, yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [109] Not that [laughing] they'd have one [] but
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [110] Yeah, well they might have one
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [111] So, so possibly that ough ought to say,the their agent described it as
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [112] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [113] the reason as being incompatibility.
[114] That, you know,th that puts it more in the context, doesn't it.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [115] Mm.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [116] It's what we mean by the official reason, it it's the P R person.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [117] Yeah, yeah, it's the reason we give to the paper, or whatever.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [118] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [119] The local paper.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [120] It was in the press release, you know.
[121] That kind of thing. ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [122] Probably wouldn't have really mattered why they split up if they were ... that rubbish to start with.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [123] Yeah, well they're making a big deal out of it aren't they?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [124] [...] if their first gig was [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [125] Hopeless, or rubbish as to put it, yeah.
[126] Who would really, who would really mind. [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [127] Well, if you're doing a erm, a rockumentary about them, somebody must mind, mustn't they.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [128] Yeah, you've got to have a reason for that.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [129] But if you, if we're doing a rockumentary about the whole [...] got to cover for whole, whole ... scene.
[130] We've got to do, how they started, whatever.
[131] You can't just leave it open at the end.
[132] Some somebody must be interested, otherwise we wouldn't be doing this ... theoretically.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [133] I mean, sometimes a band can be so bad, but they're really interesting, cos they're so bad.
[134] Does that make ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [135] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [136] I mean, you look at the Sex Pistols, for example.
[137] I mean they were [...] pretty awful weren't they in any sort of, musical sense, but they were so outrageous ... outrageously bad in some respects as well.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [138] [...] a good guitar player though in the Sex Pistols.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [139] [laugh] Ah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [140] I know when he played, he used to play it with his fists, but erm,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [141] Nice day.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [142] It is a nice day, actually.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [143] [...] quite fresh.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [144] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [145] So let's, let's just talk about, we've had a look at this one, basically we're we're sort of happy enough with this, aren't we.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [146] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [147] Gonna see how,per haps perhaps fits in with the other ... erm bits, so ... who's starting off, you're starting off aren't you?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [148] I'm starting off, yes.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [149] So tell us, tell us what happens.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [150] Well.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [151] Just have a quick, sort of chat about ... where we're going, whether it's you know, whether [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [cough]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [152] Well, in the beginning, erm, this is an interview before they start rehearsing one evening, or like, what they [...] each other play, and they're just talking about how they met and everything, cos they, the vocalist and the guitarist met in a chip shop, and knocked all the chips everywhere, and then he er, the guitarist talks about, erm, he met, I mean, he knows a drummer that's free and it turns out that it's the vo vocalist's vocalist's brother.
[153] Although she didn't know he played the drums at all,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [154] No.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [155] she just like thought he was, being a carpenter or something, and this brother, erm, her brother didn't know that she sung at all, so it all turns out to be a big surprise.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [156] Loads of coincidences.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [157] Yes.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [158] I think that's, that's pretty consistent, probably with how bands are formed, actually, isn't it, its friends of friends, and somebody knows somebody else, and somebody's looking round for a drummer, just happens that somebody mentions it to somebody else.
[159] Tends to happen that way, doesn't it.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [160] Yeah.
[161] They just grabbed this bloke who's standing outside the music area, thinking he might be a musician and he isn't, but it doesn't matter.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [162] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [163] That's it really, and they just tell them how they meet and everything.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [164] And which character's that.
[165] Or are they just a crowd.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [166] Oh, that's the bassist
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [167] So is that, er, I mean, in the in the characterisation we've got, is is there particular personalities coming through here, because I think that's one of the other things we need to make sure in the script, that we've got a consistent view of certain personalities.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [168] The thing is because, yeah, but because we're all doing different scripts ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [169] That's right.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [170] We're portra , we're doing our own personalities for
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [171] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [172] each character, so
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [173] I know.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [174] they're bound to differ.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [175] But they've got to have to be consistent,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [176] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [177] cos that's how, that's why we've got to ultimately look at all the scripts, and sort of,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [178] Yes.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [179] change them, to make them all consistent.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [180] Tie them all in.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [181] Yeah, I mean, Joe's starting it off, so, have you got a particular ... personalities for the characters.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [182] Who's the sort of ringleader here?
[183] I mean,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [184] Yeah yeah well I think er,th the vocalist is one of, one of the main people, she's very su sure, you know, of her ability, you know, despite, you know, actual, or reality anyway
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [185] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [186] Erm, the gui the guitarist is very erm ... erm, how can I put it, erm ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [187] Arrogant?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [188] Arrogant, yes, yes.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [189] Did you just say [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [190] Has got to be, like, the leader?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [191] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [192] Well in this I've got her as the, dim twit.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [193] Oh, no, that's, that's the drummer, that's the drummer. [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [194] Actual [...] of the band.
[195] I've got her as.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [196] Well, the drummer's pretty erm,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [197] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [198] stupid really.
[199] The drummer's th the very stupid one, and the bassist basically can't be bothered at all, you know [...] .
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [200] As long as that's like, is the bassist James or
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [201] Yes.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [202] Ken, Ken's the guitarist.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [203] Ken's the cocky one.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [204] Yeah.
[205] The bassist just can't be bothered.
[206] And the drummer takes everything personally, he's very er, but takes like fits and can't really see what's going on.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [207] Well, this [...] , would he take it all personally?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [208] Erm, he well he ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [209] He doesn't really understand, that's why ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [210] He he doesn't understand, it's all going over his head.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [211] Doesn't really care.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [212] Okay, so that's the first scene, and then we move to ... to
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [213] Number three.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [214] [...] three.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [215] I think.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [216] Demo isn't it.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [217] No, it's the Rock Gala, isn't it.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [218] Yeah, recording demo's number two.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [219] Yeah, recording demo [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [220] Recording demo.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [221] Okay, let's see what, see what [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [222] Right, we've got they go over to the studios and start recording.
[223] Three of the group members turn up, but one was late.
[224] Okay, and that one happens to be ... Ethel Bethel.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [225] That's yeah, that's consistent, I think, vocalists is are are always late.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [226] Every every time.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [227] Right, so she gets a phone call.
[228] She wanders off to the studio, [...] erm, a room in a house, her mum and dad's house, to answer the phone.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [229] Yeah, cos she she could say she's doing her hair, she did coming, I mean, she's doing her hair, or something like that, or is that terribly sexist?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [230] But it is erm, erm, if anybody wants, one of the other band members could be doing their hair.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [231] [laugh] Yeah, well that's true.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [232] Yeah. [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [233] Yeah, anyway, she she's told to get a move on.
[234] She gets moving, gets there ... she arrives fifteen minutes late.
[235] It's time, they get to start recording, but they're missing the lyrics, so she can't sing.
[236] That's because Ken forgot to photo photocopy the lyrics and they're at his house, with some other stuff and they discussed what happened on T V last night, but Ethel starts to get really annoyed, seeing as she was the one turning up late, [...] and like, she was on about, we're paying a lot of money for this studio, let's use it.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [237] Yeah, that's true.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [238] But she turned up late to start off with.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [239] Yeah, then they'll all have a go at her.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [240] What do you mean, you turned up fifteen minutes late.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [241] Yeah, then have a big argument, then.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [242] Stand up [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [243] [...] fall ou fall out, not getting anything done at all.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [244] Well, that's basically it, there.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [245] So are they all gonna fall out, at the end, and not get anything done.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [246] No, it's it's going to the end of the interview.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [247] [...] can't we have some violence [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [248] See the thing is, Ethel, she's gonna, get romantically involved with Ken
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [249] [...] with
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [250] Oh no.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [251] I think, I think that's not the necessary one.
[252] It's not the drummer [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [253] Bit of a twist in the story line, isn't it.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [254] Big, yes, a big twist.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [255] Okay, so they've just done their demo, but then are they gonna take demo to ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [256] Yeah, [...] organising the rock gala.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [257] To you, to you.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [258] Rock gala, to me, yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [259] Which is a bloody good thing, really that I started off with the tape, [...] hands
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [260] Cos I was originally gonna let them do an audition for you, but I thought, na.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [261] No, I think [...] tape, tape sounds like a good idea.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [262] Erm, erm, they go to see, they, first of all it starts with them looking at a notice board with the notice on it.
[263] Then they continue, they hand you the tape, you ask them a few questions, like what the band's called, how long you've been working together, and bla bla bla, and then erm, I think I I'm actually doing it with Kent and James and they're not thick.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [264] No, oh, no, they're not ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [265] But, they're not, I don't have them down as thick, but they
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [266] No, no.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [267] [...] is
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [268] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [269] Mm, right, okay, that's alright then.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [270] And then erm, erm, I've lost my thread now ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [271] Yeah James and ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [272] Kent
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [273] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [274] Yeah, right, and then erm, Kent or one of them is talking to you giving them your address,an no, giving them their address.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [275] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [276] And so that you could send them the information about it all, and then James is just talking into the camera, saying, oh I'm really glad that this is happening, the band's gonna be really happy, finally we're on our way, bla bla, [clapping] and then it ends.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [277] Yeah, but I was thinking of ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [278] Oh no, then it goes to the rehearsals, that's the bit of the script I haven't done.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [279] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [280] It shows a few rehearsals as well.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [281] That's quite good.
[282] Yes, yeah.
[283] I think you'd have a er er scene of, you know, Jonathan listening to the demo in his office and [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [284] That's an idea actually, yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [285] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [286] So that's afterwards, yeah,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [287] That's afterwards, yeah
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [288] So so wouldn't one normally, if they were that bad, refuse them.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [289] No.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [290] No, you can just look into the camera and say, erm, [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [291] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [292] Give 'em a chance.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [293] That's not fair, that's not fair.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [294] Mm.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [295] No names mentioned.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK)
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [296] No, it's not [...] so, so, how do I get everything out then, if nothing is [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [297] Aw, it's like you said [...] only got two other bands.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [298] [laughing] it's exactly what you need, though []
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [299] They can go on first [...] sort of warm up band and that'll put everybody else in context.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [300] Exactly, make everybody else look good.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [301] Right, so the then we got the the gig.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [302] Yeah, which John was doing.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [303] Yeah.
[304] Yeah, he's talking about, he's doing a rockumentary type thing with clips of the gig, that sort of thing.
[305] Should be interesting.
[306] Erm ... in fact we, can we have a rock gala this term, perhaps we can fill them, fill them with imaginary er, gig.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [307] And who, who are these characters gonna be, anyway.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [308] I mean, what have we, what have we done so far, and then think about actually creating this group.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [309] Well, I'll be the drummer.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [310] I'm gonna be the drummer, and
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [311] Right.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [312] I'll be the director.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [313] [laugh] okay [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [314] We did say, that that if possible we shouldn't be, actually in it.
[315] But for the sake, I think we have to make an exception, perhaps in Joe's case, because he actually is ... a musician as well.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [316] Was there any scenes with all all the characters in, because that, I mean, you're [...] isn't it.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [317] Mm.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [318] [...] really, the other three people can be filming it.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [319] Exactly.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [320] I mean, it would make it easier from the point of rehearsing.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [321] Yeah, I mean [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [322] Yeah well I know but it's nice.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [323] Mm.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [324] Yeah, but if we're in it, who's gonna film it?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [325] Exactly. [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [326] [...] it it does need ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [327] I could have drummed in from outside.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [328] Right, to play ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [329] Well, I dunno he could be erm,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [330] Bass guitar.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [331] He could be either the bass guitar, or the
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [332] Cos he plays a bit of guitar,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [333] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [334] so we really want him not to play, case, of being not familiar with [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [335] Well, exactly.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [336] That would be quite good.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [337] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [338] And then we need a guitarist.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [339] Well, [...] could be the guitarist [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [340] John would look good as the guitarist.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [341] Mm?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [342] John would look good as a guitarist, wouldn't he.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [343] Yeah, he does play a little bit.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [344] Yeah, that'll do, yeah, that'll be alright, then.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [345] And then we need, erm,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [346] Ethel.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [347] Ethel Bethel.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [348] Yeah, [...] can be it. [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [349] Yeah, but George can sing.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [350] No I can't. [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [351] Yeah, but not this sort of stuff.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [352] So, how's that gonna work then, if if we need people to film and things, cos I'm not gonna film it for you.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [353] Well, I I I've well ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [354] Well, not in every scene is there, all the characters anyway.
[355] [...] sort of take turns in doing it.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [356] Exactly, apart from, apart from the ... [...] play, the actual play.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [357] What the actual ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [358] And then we've got and [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [359] Do we have ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [360] Exactly.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [361] [...] recording
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [362] ask the questions?
[363] Like on our, on our scenes.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [364] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [365] But I'll be sitting there asking ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [366] Yeah, of course, yeah probably.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [367] whatever questions I'm gonna ask.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [368] [...] interviewer ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [369] [...] eventually get to be [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [370] So what did you do [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [371] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [372] try and get somebody else to ask, then we fill their own you know, scenes, cos then we get what we want.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [373] But is there, is there a situation where there's one, where where you're all in it? [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [374] All.
[375] On only in like the the rehearsals and, like the actual gig and ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [376] But even then, I mean, if he wants to be the interviewer.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [377] [...] can't just like, putting people off.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [378] [...] yeah, have to have the whole group there.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [379] No, not really.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [380] They've all got to be sat down, but
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [381] No well ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [382] [...] chair over there
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [383] I was thinking, erm, in like
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [384] got to have the whole group there, otherwise it's ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [385] one line in my, in my interviews, in my interview
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [386] [...] always said, but they don't necessarily.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [387] No, no, no, in my interviews, erm, I done, erm, two two people, and they just, that way they can talk about each other without erm, having a fight or anything.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [388] Yeah.
[389] I mean, all th this script
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [390] Mind you, it's the,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [391] one person and the interviewer, all of it.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [392] Yeah,mi mind you, though, if Pete does it with everyone, then it's a change to what's been going on usually, it would be nice for a change.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [393] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [394] If you see what I mean, to have that, sort of, contrast.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [395] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [396] While everyone's there.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [397] So I mean, I'm not gonna point the questions at anyone in particular, I'm just like have them answered, [...] but I might just say to is this normal for her to be late.
[398] Now one of them will pipe up, yeah, she bloody always late.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [399] Yeah, well, whereas in that, if they they when the recording the demo they have to be together, don't they.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [400] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [401] [...] Ethel's not there anyway. [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [402] Not for hers to boot,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [403] So if if, but if you're interviewing, that only leaves
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [404] Yeah, but you know, he can
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [405] Yeah
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [406] hold the cameras as well
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [407] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [408] Sorry?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [409] He can hold the camera as well.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [410] What and interview [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [411] But, wait, but the thing is yeah, there's only a few scenes where everyone's in it, right, and where people, everyone is in it, then obviously I'm gonna have help from you or from Andy aren't I? [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [412] Well,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [413] I think we can do it.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [414] I know you're not convinced,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [415] No, I'm not convinced because
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [416] You're not convinced, but I think we can do it.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [417] The idea is not that you're actors on this course, but that you're learning how to film [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [418] [...] objection aside, I don't want to be in this at all.
[419] Not interviewer, nothing.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [420] Is that all of us.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [421] So I mean, we could, we could recruit people in to do it, but the problem there is they've got to be free at the times when this course runs.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [422] See, the thing is, everyone's gonna get the chance to be behind the camera or do some directing, because it's not.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [423] Yeah, well if that's, if that's, I mean, that's all I am concerned about, that everybody does
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [424] Yeah, [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [425] that directing,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [426] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [427] everybody does a bit of camera work and sound and things and everybody experiences those different roles that you have so far covered, you know, across the documentary, but not in every act.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [428] Mm.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [429] Yeah well yeah everybody'll get the chance, because erm ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [430] Definitely.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [431] Yeah, but why [...] .
[432] So so we're saying, we perhaps need an interviewer,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [433] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [434] and we need a ... we need
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [435] Yeah, [...] discuss this really.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [436] So, can we also think who this interviewer would be, wouldn't it be, sort of a really trendy sort of person, with, you know, I don't know ... yellow hair, or, you know, sort of
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [437] Oh, I don't know.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [438] [...] documentary.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [439] two people, you know.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [440] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [441] Where they're quite, sort of, trendy looking, aren't they.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [442] I think they'd just be normal.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [443] Just be ... I think they'd just be normal.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [444] It's alright I was thinking about ... you've seen
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [445] But they aren't normal, are they, I mean, you look at N M E and you look at the language they use, I mean, that's not normal.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [446] No, I wa I was, er er I I was thinking anyway, that it wasn't exactly like that, it's more like a Forty Minutes type thing.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [447] Oh.
[448] [laugh] B B C.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [449] Yeah, very over normal,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [450] Mm.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [451] extremely normal, because erm, I don't think N M E [...] interviewers would bother to do something like this.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [452] So you want some something out of cutting a complete contrast between the sort of person who's being interviewed, sort of
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [453] Yeah, I think that would probably
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [454] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [455] work better.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [456] And er, laid back, perhaps [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [457] How how many actual scenes are there.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [458] Erm, five, well five [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [459] Five.
[460] Acts.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [461] Five acts, and the people that took [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [462] Sections.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [463] But have you got the [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [464] [laugh] scenes.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [465] No, no, no.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [466] But [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [467] Have you got, have you got a ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [468] First one.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [469] First last.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [470] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [471] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [472] First one.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [473] Second erm [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [474] Yeah. [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [475] So we can have like commercial breaks sticking adverts in between.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [476] Oh, oh.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [477] [...] good idea.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [478] Oh.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [479] [...] break coming up, you say, right [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [480] [...] like zang, have little cliff-hangers.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [481] Break it up a bit.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [482] Little cliff-hangers in between.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [483] You can have your adverts in there.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [484] It's a shame that they're all about a drink but anyway.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [485] This is like some [...] getting done with the ads.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [486] Yeah, but ... [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [487] , and everyone else in the group.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [488] Oh yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [489] Cos I've been trying to organise it.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [490] So why don't we do this other one, your your static [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [491] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [492] I'm actually, no I'm seriously considering doing it.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [493] Right.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [494] But I I really like to work with that lot, because the advert would be so funny.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [495] Yeah, the exact, the set that ... would wait forever, wouldn't it.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [496] That's true.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [497] So perhaps we ought to realise the fact that we've never actually gonna get that one down.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [498] True. [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [499] Unless I could do, two.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [500] Yeah, well perhaps, well we'll need one down there [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [501] Oh yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [502] do the one that you can do.
[503] Okay, well.
[504] What what we need to do, is make sure these scripts are done before half term really, don't we. [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [505] When's half term?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [506] Next week, I think.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [507] Next week [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [508] We really ought to be rehearsing this stuff, well finalising the scripts after half term.
[509] Yeah, and adapting and the modifying [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [510] I think what we need to do.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [511] [...] need to be rehearsing pretty much straight away.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [512] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [513] Once we've got all the scripts done, I think we should erm, allocate roles to certain people behind the scene, so we know exactly what we're doing.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [514] In each ... in each section
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [515] Yeah ... do [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [516] Who's doing what, yes, okay.
[517] Right, okay.
[518] So ... is, I mean, you're nearly finished with your script,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [519] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [520] is there a chance that you could work on this before Friday, and have a script.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [521] I think so, yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [522] What about you ?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [523] Definitely, I've got three quarters of it done, already.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [524] Right, so, so hopefully we'll have a look at all the scripts, then, on Friday.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [525] We've got time [...] though, don't we.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [526] Yeah, but somebody else set [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [527] You know, I mean, they'll be some changes.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [528] It's not essential, is it.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [529] No.
[530] There'll be some changes. [second lecture recorded on a side]
(PS4T1) [531] There's a couple of people who haven't got the essay titles from ... from last Friday, erm, have you got your copy of it handy , and that they could [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [532] No, [...] I didn't copy it down [...]
(PS4T1) [533] You didn't copy it down either, have you no intention of doing it, or something.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [534] I did, [...] at the back.
(PS4T1) [535] Well, I've got it written down here, and at the end of the lesson you can get it.
[536] Is there anybody not want spare scrap paper.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [537] Got loads, yeah, got tons at home, mum [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [538] No, because we're doing something else now.
[539] Okay, we don't want the entire lesson held up while you did what you were supposed to have done on Friday, right.
[540] Now, we're working on language, now, but because a question turns up every year on paper one, to do with education, we're going to be considering education, and we're going to consider education in the broadest possible way, and that is, how do we know things.
[541] Or more specifically, start considering how you learn things.
[542] ... Now you should all have a spare scrap of paper that's blank on one side, out of my recycled paper box, okay.
[543] At the top of this I want you to write, either a skill or an area of knowledge that you have, that you possess, okay, that you're pretty proud of.
[544] That you know, that if anybody asks you to do this, or asks you a question connected with this, you can do it.
[545] Right.
[546] It could be, when you go to Quasar you win every time.
[547] It,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [548] I wouldn't bet on it.
(PS4T1) [549] it could be that you're the world's expert on Michael Jackson's greatest hits, I don't care, okay, it can be anything, if you were in the scouts, maybe you can light a fire with two matches.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
(PS4T1) [550] I don't know, whatever.
[551] Or half a can of paraffin, if you're anything like most of the scouts I've met.
[552] But you see what I mean.
[553] It could just be that you're the person in your family who knows what's on all those video tapes that nobody's labelled up.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [554] Oh, that's me.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
(PS4T1) [555] You're not, okay.
[556] Whatever, I want you to think about, your skill, what you're an expert at, and write it at the top of the bit of paper.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [557] Just one?
(PS4T1) [558] Well, one'll do, okay. [classroom chatter] . ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [559] Where did you get it from.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [560] [...] haven't done anything.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [561] Well, you're the leader.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [562] Yeah, but I can't exactly write that down, can I?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [563] Like like telling people I take after somebody important.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [564] What are you good at.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [565] I don't know.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [566] I know, I can cut a loaf of bread on a machine.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [567] Yeah, so can I.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [568] I can work a till.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [569] [...] medium slice.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [570] Medium or thick slice, par bake, yeah, we can do thick slice too.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [571] Oh, okay.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [572] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [573] We know.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [574] Oh, that's bad, that is.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [575] I know.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [576] I've experience of cooking sixty to seventy sausage rolls, every Saturday.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [577] [...] [classroom chatter] .
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [578] [...] I can work a till.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [579] [...] fifty pounds, it's a real bugger.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [580] [...] spend any money.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [581] [...] spend fifty pounds worth of bread, do you?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [582] No true.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [583] I can work a till?
[584] Oh, right.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [585] Yeah, and I know what to do with cheques and credit cards.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [586] I'm a professional pick-pocket.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [587] I'm a professional stamp collector.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...] [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [588] I don't know, I still can't write anything down. [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [589] [...] spend money really well.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [590] I can work a till and I know what to do with cheques and credit cards.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [591] Yeah.
[592] I think I'll put that as well [...] Mind you like everybody else [...] put that down, but
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [593] Well it's a skill I have.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [594] I have, I did have experience with cheques and credit cards, but that was when I was working at the chemist, but now we don't take cheques.
(PS4T1) [595] Right.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [596] Don't take cheques.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [597] Where do you work?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [598] I'm putting that to.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [599] Have we all got something, sh, sh, sh, have we all got something.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [600] Yeah.
(PS4T1) [601] Right, now, and here's the tricky bit.
[602] I've looked over the shoulder at a few of these and they are obviously not the sort of thing, that you came sliding out of your mother's womb knowing how to do.
[603] Okay.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
(PS4T1) [604] Er, so some how or another you've learned them, right.
[605] Right, could you manage to remember how you got that skill, or that knowledge, okay.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
(PS4T1) [606] Er, you might also want to consider, er any gains that you have got from having this skill or knowledge.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [607] Gains?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [608] Gains.
(PS4T1) [609] Gains.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [610] Gains.
(PS4T1) [611] [...] does it just make you feel good, or, has it helped you to do something else that you wanted to do.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [612] [...] [classroom chatter] .
(PS4T1) [613] If somebody's written it about somebody else's biography, okay, ... it's auto if it's, you know.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [614] Okay, now, what you should have in front of you, is a recipe for successful learning, because what you've got at the top, right, what you've got at the top is something that you've learnt, and you think you're pretty good at it, and what you've got in the middle is, how you got to be good at it, and what you've got at the end, is what you gain from having it.
[615] [...] Really, if we can make every single one your A levels follow that pattern, for you, we'd have excellent results at the end of the day, okay.
[616] But, let's just see, if there is a pattern, or if everybody's different.
[617] Okay, so what we'll do, is we'll combine.
[618] First of all, perhaps if you could all let everybody else know what we're talking about, what your particular skill is.
[619] Do we start over here with Martin.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
(PS4T1) [620] And go round.
Martin (PS4T2) [621] It's not exactly a skill, but, I've got good erm, at work I've got a good memory, like a knowledge of all the different items an the counter.
(PS4T1) [622] [...] so yours is work related.
Martin (PS4T2) [623] Yeah.
(PS4T1) [624] Good memory, for all the items on the counter, you have learned and classified a variety of material.
Martin (PS4T2) [625] Cheeses and things like that, you know.
(PS4T1) [626] Cheeses, okay.
[627] [laugh] Right, okay, Jo?
Jo (PS4T3) [628] Good at making quiche.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
(PS4T1) [629] Quiche.
[630] Good at making quiche.
[631] Fine, er a number of skills involved there.
[632] Right.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [633] Oh, yes.
[634] I mean, perhaps sometime after the lesson, you can tell me how you stop the pastry on the bottom going soggy.
[635] [laugh] [...] Okay, Vicky.
Vicky (PS4T4) [636] Good at making scones.
(PS4T1) [637] Scones.
[638] That's mine, yes.
[639] That's the one I always use for this exercise is scones, great.
[640] Lynn.
Lynn (PS4T5) [641] Playing the clarinet.
(PS4T1) [642] Playing the clarinet.
[643] We've got a diversity here, haven't we.
[644] What about the next table.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [645] Knowing what's on T V every night.
(PS4T1) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [646] Knowing what's on T V every night.
(PS4T1) [647] Knowing what's on television every night.
[648] Okay, so the portable Radio Times.
[649] Okay.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [650] Star signs and that.
(PS4T1) [651] Yes, you're good on astrology, is it?
[652] Astrology?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [653] Yes.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
(PS4T1) [654] Okay.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [655] Really cool.
(PS4T1) [656] Darren?
Darren (PS4T6) [657] Erm, eighties music.
(PS4T1) [658] Eighties music.
[659] Right, well again, classification of a wide l lot of material well all three of those, yeah.
[660] David?
David (PS4T7) [661] I like sport [...] .
(PS4T1) [662] Sport.
David (PS4T7) [663] Yeah.
(PS4T1) [664] Any one in particular?
David (PS4T7) [665] Boxing, football, athletics.
(PS4T1) [666] Boxing, football, athletics.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
(PS4T1) [667] Okay, in boxing, have you got a particular move, a particular tactic, a particular punch, that they've
David (PS4T7) [668] Yeah.
(PS4T1) [669] Which is.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
David (PS4T7) [670] No, just go mad, no.
[671] It's all tactics.
(PS4T1) [672] So it's, you're good on the tactics.
David (PS4T7) [673] Suppose so.
(PS4T1) [674] Okay, right.
[675] Assa?
Assa (PS4T8) [676] [...] cricket.
(PS4T1) [677] Cricket?
Assa (PS4T8) [678] Mm.
(PS4T1) [679] Yes.
[680] Fine.
[681] Knowledge of, or skill at playing or [...]
Assa (PS4T8) [682] Skill and knowledge.
(PS4T1) [683] Skill and knowledge.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [684] phworgh.
(PS4T1) [685] [laugh] okay.
[686] Hannah?
Hannah (PS4T9) [687] Erm, I can remember or orders and prices at work ... that I have to do.
(PS4T1) [688] Again, it's memory and classification of material.
[689] [...] ,
[690] yes?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [691] I can work a till and I know what to do with cheques and credit cards when people pay.
(PS4T1) [692] Right.
[693] S so th th there's a variety of different skills involved in there, the the mechanical [...] the till and the ... knowing what to do with cheques, credit cards, er, have you got a sense of when you've got to check up on a card, or something like that.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [694] Yeah, I've caught two bad ones.
(PS4T1) [695] There you are you see, that is a very definite skill, which she, you're using an awful lot of that one, it would be interesting to know how you developed that that skill.
[696] Stephen?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [697] Ozzy Osborn
(PS4T1) [698] Ozzy Osborn Again, material, classification, memory.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [699] Red Dwarf.
(PS4T1) [700] Red Dwarf, again, the same, the material, the knowledge.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [701] Erm, working on a till [...] knowing what to do at work.
(PS4T1) [702] Right, another work related one.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [703] The same as well.
(PS4T1) [704] And the same with you.
[705] Okay, isn't it interesting, isn't depressing, that absolutely none of these things was taught you at school, except possibly the sport?
David (PS4T7) [706] No.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
(PS4T1) [707] I mean, I knew what was going to happen when I started the exercise, but if you contemplate it from a teacher's point of view, if I go out and commit suicide or break down you'll know why, won't you.
[708] [laugh] None of you have said, my deep and abiding love of Shakespeare, my knowledge of relevant quotations in Hamlet, have you, er,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [709] No.
(PS4T1) [710] You know.
[711] [laugh] Tony Morrison and American slavery, that's my area, that's [...] none of you, okay.
[712] So,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...] [laugh]
(PS4T1) [713] let's think about what this means for education, let's er, work out how you learn [...] , okay.
[714] Now I might forget some of them but, er, what about er, you, seeing as how your skill is one that I haven't been able to acquire yet, Jo how did you get to make the perfect quiche.
Jo (PS4T3) [715] Just trial and error.
(PS4T1) [716] Trial and error, I don't know, I think I've done enough of that.
[717] [laughing] Never mind [] , okay.
[718] How many of the rest of you would say that you got where you are today, in your area of expertise, with trial and error.
[719] David definitely.
[720] My scone maker here.
[721] Anybody else?
[722] When you first started work, didn't you make any mistakes, Rowena?
(PS4T1) [723] Yeah.
[724] But they're horrible about it so you don't do it again.
(PS4T1) [725] [laugh] right.
[726] [laugh] Maybe I could learn how to be really horrible. [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
(PS4T1) [727] Okay, so trial and error and involved with trial and error is something that I'm almost certain that Assa and David are going to er,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [cough]
(PS4T1) [728] come up with, and that's practice.
Assa (PS4T8) [729] Yeah, a lot of practising.
David (PS4T7) [730] Yeah.
(PS4T1) [731] Yeah, because you can't have trial and error without a lot of practice.
[732] Erm, you too, Lynn.
Lynn (PS4T5) [733] Mm.
(PS4T1) [734] Yeah, there you go.
[735] Trial and error, and ... [writing on board] practice, lots and lots of practice, okay.
[736] Anything else, er, er, Lynn did your clarinet teacher ever play the clarinet and let you see her playing it well.
Lynn (PS4T5) [737] No.
(PS4T1) [738] No.
Lynn (PS4T5) [739] Don't get taught like that, no.
(PS4T1) [740] You don't get taugh do it like that.
[741] Did you ever see anybody else makes scones before you started.
Vicky (PS4T4) [742] Erm, my mum.
(PS4T1) [743] Erm, right, precisely the same way I learnt the same skill, watching somebody else do it right.
[744] Did you ever watch people at work before you've gone into it.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [745] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [746] Yeah.
(PS4T1) [747] Yeah.
[748] Sport, erm, I remember when I learned badminton, that the teacher would show us the high smash shot down, until we saw it being done properly, if he told us the theory of it without showing us what it looked like when it was done properly, we wouldn't have known what we were aiming at.
[749] Does this ring a bell in any of the rest of you, that learned a skill.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [750] Yeah.
(PS4T1) [751] You saw it done properly, okay.
[752] Now, there are lots of you, have got skills involving just memorising or learning of, doing research on a particular subject, whether, obviously, your Red Dwarf, how to you go about it.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [753] Well I bought lots of videos and then watch them [...] a lot.
(PS4T1) [754] Aha.
[755] Well, again, it's time, the commitment here [writing on board] ... Okay.
[756] Is it the same with you with Ozzy Osborn ?
[757] ... Yeah.
[758] And you spent a lot of time reading, a lot of time finding out.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [759] Erm, do you get together with other people who share ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [760] Sometimes.
(PS4T1) [761] Sometimes.
[762] What about and the Red Dwarf.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [763] [...] kind of.
(PS4T1) [764] Kind of.
[765] Right, so also ... this, the commitment ... is shared, we'll talk about it, okay.
[766] And I expect that same thing happens with the work related one, that because you're never at work on your own, or hardly ever at work on your own, and the same thing when you started, you weren't ever on your own, you could say to people, am I doing it right.
[767] What's the best way to do this, okay.
[768] So you're learning from other people as well.
[769] Right, okay.
[770] Now the question is why, well it's pretty obvious with some, it's pretty obvious why Rachel wants to know everything on television in her life, I suppose.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
(PS4T1) [771] Planning a time ... yeah? right?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [772] Er, it's fairly obvious why you want to bake a quiche or a a flan, it's fairly obvious, is it, why you want to play the clarinet?
[773] ... Why?
Lynn (PS4T5) [774] For pleasure [...]
(PS4T1) [775] For pleasure.
[776] And the work one, there's a definite incentive of work.
[777] Now ... why are you doing A Level English? [clears throat] might want to talk that through.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [778] [...] biology. [laugh]
(PS4T1) [779] And an answer has come up, with no, because they wouldn't let me do biology, you see. [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [780] You could tell each other about this, you don't have to tell me.
[781] [...] I'm pretty aware of it.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [talk in background]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [782] I was under the impression that we could choose our books.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [783] [talk in background] .
(PS4T1) [784] Okay, have you had long enough to [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [785] Eh?
(PS4T1) [786] So you've got an idea
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [787] Yeah.
(PS4T1) [788] about why erm, [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [talk in background]
(PS4T1) [789] The reasons will vary.
[790] Some of you, I'm quite sure chose to do A Level English, because you were good at it at G C S E,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [791] Mm.
(PS4T1) [792] and you thought you would carry on being good at it at A level.
[793] What?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [794] Erm, some of you chose to do it because you like reading, you like reading books, and you thought, it would be a chance to get an A Level doing something that you enjoy doing.
[795] A lot of you are doing it because you want to go onto further or higher education, and you needed a third A Level to add to your other two.
[796] Right.
[797] Now, could we just consider this, because ... you're all about seventeen which means that you'll be starting taking driving lessons some of you, quite shortly.
[798] Have you ever met anybody who took driving lessons, without wanting to drive a car at the end of it.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [799] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [800] Yes.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [801] No.
(PS4T1) [802] Have you?
[803] People have said, I'm taking driving lessons, but I never ever want to drive a car again in my life, afterwards.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [804] Yeah.
[805] It's just in case they ever needed to.
[806] They [...]
(PS4T1) [807] Well, in case.
[808] But they didn't say they didn't ever want to ever drive a car again.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [809] They didn't want to drive, but they did, they learnt to drive, but they they said they never really wanted to do it, but only if they really really had to do it. [...]
(PS4T1) [810] Had to.
[811] A kind of a safety thing.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [812] Yeah.
(PS4T1) [813] Most of you, when you take driving lessons, what end are you gonna have in view?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [814] Bus driver.
(PS4T1) [815] [laugh] [...] Right, yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [816] [...] yes, you are taking, going to take driving lessons in order that you can drive.
[817] But you're taking English lessons so as you can go and get a degree in sociology or physiotherapy
(PS4T1) [818] ... doing A Levels, okay.
[819] Er, it's it's [...] you don't have to be frightened of letting me know this, because, it it stands to reason, that it's going to happen, okay.
[820] Now, so we haven't got the reason for you gaining this skill that you had in the case of making scones, playing the clarinet.
[821] You learnt to play the clarinet, so she can play the clarinet.
[822] So [...] orchestra.
[823] You don't learn to play the clarinet so that you can erm, be a physiotherapist.
[824] Okay?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [825] [laugh] and fair enough, but you can be doing A Level English because you want to be a physiotherapist, and you need that other A Level, is that not true?
[826] Yeah, er, I mean, I'm not picking, I'm I'm, I mean Rachel's in my tutor group, so I know that there is another A Level subject that she's really very good at.
[827] And er, gets more excited about than she does English, you see.
[828] So erm,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [829] This is, you know, this is how it happens.
[830] When we're in the class full of people, and we don't have the incentive, that we don't want to do A Level English for it's own sake, but for another goal which is one further removed.
[831] What can we do about learning it.
[832] Do you think there are some of the skills that we got from here ... Now there's one rather important, that I didn't put up.
[833] It was involved with your trial and error and practice, but it was certainly involved with Vicky and that is ... watching, or learning from [writing on board] okay.
[834] Now, can we get some of these into our English, the trial and error, yes.
[835] If you avoid writing because you make mistakes, then when you are forced to write an exam, you'll still make the mistakes.
[836] If you write a fair amount, and read your work critically and let other people criticise it, you will get better.
[837] Think about people who learn really really important skills, how did they learn them?
[838] Teachers learn in part, by sitting in classrooms, watching other teachers teach.
[839] Did you know that?
[840] Er, how do surgeons learn to do complicated operations.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
(PS4T1) [841] Yeah, yeah, they learn their basic moves on corpses, so it doesn't do any harm.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [842] Just as you learn ... you learn your basic modes of essay writing in essays that I'm not going mark for A Level exams, okay, erm, but there is another way.
[843] They have to attend enormous numbers of operations and watch experts doing it.
[844] Alright.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [845] Sorry.
[846] [laugh] So there you go.
[847] How can we relate this to learning English.
[848] Trial and error, yeah, do every bit of work that's set.
[849] Practise writing even although you think you're rotten at it.
[850] Yes.
[851] It's sometimes not obvious what mistakes you've made in ... English, it's pretty obvious to Vicky and myself when we make duff scones.
[852] How can we tell?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [853] Tastes horrible [...]
(PS4T1) [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [854] Yeah.
[855] Erm, and you know when you've gone wrong in the clarinet.
[856] Right.
[857] Do you know when you've gone wrong in the clarinet, and you know when you've gone wrong with the till.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [858] And, if you remember the layout of the cheese counter you find out pretty quickly that the,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [859] I didn't find out
(PS4T1) [860] Sorry,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [861] any of the counters.
(PS4T1) [862] Er, any of the counters.
[863] Yeah?
[864] Okay.
[865] Well what happens if you go to the wrong place?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [866] If they ask for some cheese, you won't get it on the meat counter will you?
(PS4T1) [867] Yeah, quite.
[868] So you find out right away.
[869] Okay, and this is difficult when you hand essays in, isn't it.
[870] Very difficult.
[871] Time commitment.
[872] Do we have to talk about that word, really.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
(PS4T1) [873] I mean, how much time do you put into the Red Dwarf?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...] [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
(PS4T1) [874] More than you put into an A Level subject?
[875] Full time.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [876] Yeah, probably.
(PS4T1) [877] Yeah! [laugh] and not only that, not only that, but Dan talks about it to other fans, right.
[878] Now ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [879] sharing it.
[880] Well, we have talking English lessons, and we hope that you don't stray off the topic too much.
[881] Sharing ... okay.
[882] How often do you talk about what you've done in English with somebody else?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [883] Think about it.
[884] I won't listen, honest, you can ... just discuss that with yourselves.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...] [talk in background]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [885] Are you good at origami?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [886] Origami?
[887] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [888] You should have put that down.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [889] I'm gonna, I can make you a paper star, if you'd like.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [890] Yes go on.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [891] Only if you make me an isosceles triangle, first.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [892] Isosceles triangle.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [893] I mean, no no, an equilateral triangle, please. [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [894] An equilateral triangle.
(PS4T1) [895] Okay?
[896] Now.
[897] Now, one of the ways that you will get better, is talking about it to people, okay.
[898] Now, you may be a little embarrassed to discuss how you work with people other than in this classroom, although, as the course goes on, you'll find more and more people doing Hamlet in other classes, and you might find, especially when you're in the upper sixth, when someone in the lower sixth comes to you and says, what does this mean ... that you can talk about it with them, okay.
[899] Er, but, you can talk about other aspects of English ... very, very easily with other people ... and that is what you read in newspapers, okay.
[900] I read this very interesting article on ... corruption in government.
[901] ... What was in it ... somebody asks you.
[902] Could you tell them?
[903] Probably if you thought that, okay, I read this fascinating article about, what's his name Richard [...] th th you know one, the one who plays Spock.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [904] Nimoy
(PS4T1) [905] Nimoy, that, Nimoy, right, I think ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [906] I read this fascinating article about him, now you can see how interested I am in Star Trek, can't you. [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [907] Not at all.
[908] Yes, but, Dan if Dan has read an extremely interesting article about this actor who plays in Star Trek, and he meets his friend who is also a Star Trek fan.
[909] He'd tell him what was in the article, probably won't ya.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [910] Mm, yeah, probably.
(PS4T1) [911] Probably, yeah, yes, you will.
[912] Er, certainly I'm sure Rachel shares her information, even if it's only to say, you can't watch that because something else is on Channel Four at the same time.
[913] Right?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [914] Mm.
(PS4T1) [915] You share the information you got, but you talk about it, and you hear what other people have got to say.
[916] Right, and you can do this with newspaper articles.
[917] Erm, you are going to be practising at least one A Level skill when you do that, and that's precis.
[918] Because when they say, what did the article say, and you tell them, you're summarising it, right?
[919] So you can all do a summary, every single one of you, okay.
[920] So keep practising that summary.
[921] The other thing you can learn is style.
[922] What is an appropriate style for an appropriate situation, because you all read outside English lessons, and you all know that, well, what about this one, what sort of style is that in.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [cough]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [923] Mm.
(PS4T1) [924] What would that be useful for, what's the audience?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [925] Language [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [926] [...] college.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [927] What do you think that style is.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [928] How does it get its information across.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [929] By writing [...]
(PS4T1) [930] A list, a very simple statement.
[931] And you've worked out the audience.
[932] What about this one.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [933] Do the same for this one.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [934] Yeah, it's good isn't it, yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [935] And then for these.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [936] You recognise these styles, that's what you're supposed to do.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [937] You recognise this style?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [938] Well, alright, then, yeah.
(PS4T1) [939] And this one.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
(PS4T1) [940] Now ... have you all read examples of those styles, before?
[941] Have you?
[942] Have you read the, have you read articles or any pieces of writing that were like that before?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [943] You read examples of styles like that before?
[944] Yes.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [945] Have you read examples in styles like that before?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [946] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [947] That's an encyclopedia, yes.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [948] And you've read bookmarks giving information.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [949] Right.
[950] You've all read these styles before, is that true?
[951] You might not have read those actual pages before, but you can recognise the style, where it comes from.
[952] You could recognise the style of a weather report, an Agony Aunt ... all sorts of different types of writing, er, you could probably, if your reading is as wide as it ought to be, recognise the style of a leader from er, pretty heavy newspaper, Guardian, Independent, Observer, that sort of thing, could you?
[953] Could you tell the difference between that and the leading article from the Sun?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [954] Yeah.
(PS4T1) [955] Yeah, mhm, you could, you wouldn't get those two muddled up.
[956] Er, you could tell the difference between er, newspaper on crime and the chief constable's report.
[957] Right?
[958] Or, er, an article in the Times about crime prevention, or problems with youth, you could tell the difference, couldn't you.
[959] You don't seem so sure about that, could you?
[960] Yes, of course you could, and not just because there's pretty coloured pictures in one and not in the other ... although that's part of it, that's part of the presentation.
[961] Now, if I asked you, right, to present information about this A Level, cos it's something you all know about, okay.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
(PS4T1) [962] In the form of ... a very brief list of what we want to know about A Level, could you do it?
[963] Could you make a book mark out of it.
[964] Ju just ... no,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [965] a book mark of the information you need to know about English A Levels.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [yawn]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [966] Probably, yeah.
[967] Could you write an article for somebody in the top year of your last school, about English A Level, and what they should be able to, what they should expect?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [968] Yes
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [969] Yes, definitely.
(PS4T1) [970] Yeah, you could do that.
[971] Would they look the same?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [972] Don't know.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [973] Don't know.
(PS4T1) [974] Could you write an encyclopedia entry on ... Beloved?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [975] No.
(PS4T1) [976] No?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [977] No.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [978] Depends how well you know the book.
(PS4T1) [979] Sorry?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [980] Depends how well you know the book.
(PS4T1) [981] Well, you ought to know it well enough to write five or six lines about it, which is all you need for a book.
[982] Right ... and you would know what style to use, wouldn't you, or would you?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [983] Oh, no.
(PS4T1) [984] What's the difference between the encyclopedia style and the other styles, then.
[985] Can you work that out.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [986] It just comes straight to the point [...]
(PS4T1) [987] Yes, it's concise, so is the book mark, it's informative, it comes straight, but, it ... it's very factual, isn't it.
[988] It doesn't say, some people think A Levels are a good thing and some people think A Levels are a bad thing, it wouldn't say something like that, it wouldn't be vague like that, it would say, A Levels are the qualification issued in most sixth forms in England and Wales, right, erm ... they generally need a two year course of study.
[989] They are recognised by all British Universities.
[990] It'd say something like that, wouldn't it.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [991] Mm.
(PS4T1) [992] The facts about A Levels.
[993] Right.
[994] Next stage up from G C S E, the stage before er, a degree.
[995] You're happy about that.
[996] Now, we're going to work on summary skills this week, and you have summary skills already.
[997] If I said to you I missed Neighbours on Friday, what happened, a lot of you could tell me, couldn't you?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [998] Right.
[999] [laugh] Yeah, I, yes, but a lot of people could tell me, right.
[1000] Er, and if I said it about any television programme you had watched.
[1001] If I sa said to you, tell me, could you describe to me briefly the layout of where is it you work?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1002] Safeway.
(PS4T1) [1003] Safeway.
[1004] You could do it, couldn't you.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1005] Easily.
(PS4T1) [1006] Easily, yeah.
[1007] Right, if I say ... could you summarise the plot of Revenge of Khan could you do it?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1008] Who.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...] [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
(PS4T1) [1009] Shows you how stupid I am about, now which is the Revenge of Khan then?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1010] [...] Star Trek.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
(PS4T1) [1011] Yeah, okay.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [1012] Yes, I bet, sorry?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [1013] [laugh] There you are, you see.
[1014] There you are ... and again you get the problem, you see, that I'm just not interested, so I don't learn these things.
[1015] Erm, and it's probably the problem that a lot of you have with Hamlet, you see.
[1016] Okay, Red Dwarf, oh dear, character study of ... whatever the Liverpudlian's called ... I've forgotten [...] yes.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [1017] You can do that, yeah, of course you could.
[1018] Right.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [1019] Could I just have your attention, it's just the end, for practice, for summary, you need to be very aware of why certain pieces of writing are written the way they are.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1020] Mm.
(PS4T1) [1021] Which audience demands which style, okay, we're going to be practising that over the next week, and the other skills to do with summary.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Martin (PS4T2) [1022] ... for the benefit of those who've forgotten.
[1023] You were going to look at ways of classifying the short stories you've been looking at, when y , sort of, to look at similarities between short stories, like which ones deal with husband and wife relationships, which ones are about loneliness, I mean, use your paper, it's it's only there for scrap paper, you haven't got to produce something that's gonna be pinned up on the wall.
[1024] Erm, and there is some more paper over on the the easel over there, if you want another sheet.
[1025] But just use it first to brain-storm some ideas about, you know, what sort of things are the stories about, what ideas, what themes are they dealing with, and which stories deal with those themes.
[1026] Alright, and I'll talk about, well, the lesson finishes at twelve, so if you have about a quarter of an hour, twenty minutes on that, then what I want ... each group to have someone who will report back on what the group's been talking about in the next twenty minutes or so.
[1027] Alright.
[1028] Any questions on that?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Martin (PS4T2) [1029] That's fine, [...] things that you haven't thought of, that's coming from what they've done, okay?
[1030] So erm, spokesperson for this group.
[1031] Shall I hold it up for you, and erm, or somebody'll hold it up for you.
[1032] If you'd like to turn round, turn round and address the attentive multitude.
[1033] You might not be able to see all of this [...] somebody will talk you through it.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1034] Go for it.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1035] Right, we sub-divided the whole book into four main areas, we divided into, husband and wife, male and female, loneliness and death.
[1036] Most of the stories [...] into categories, [...] one or two.
[1037] For a husband and wife list we've got [...] , the Black Madonna, [...] the Stone Trees, and the Weekend.
[1038] And for male and female, we've got all of the ones above and [...] , Summer Picnic, The Different Nights, A Love Match, Miss [...] Love Letters, The Man [...] .
[1039] For loneliness we've got Miss [...] Love Letters, Annie, No Survivor [...] Stone Trees, Mannequin, [...] The Visitor, [...] The Picnic, Summer Picnic, Different Nights, Love Match, and New People.
[1040] For death, we've got Passages of [...] The Different Nights, No Survivor and The Visitor.
Martin (PS4T2) [1041] Yes, any questions.
[1042] Any comments.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1043] It's better than ours.
Martin (PS4T2) [1044] Better than yours.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1045] Yeah.
Martin (PS4T2) [1046] Okay.
[1047] Well that's a good lead into yours, then.
[1048] Would you like to talk about yours, thank you.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1049] [...] this was Isabel's idea of [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1050] Shut up!
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1051] No.
[1052] Erm. [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1053] Isabel's going to work [...] paper.
Martin (PS4T2) [1054] Do you want again, talk about this one, first, or gonna ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1055] No, no, no.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1056] [...] as you can see.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1057] Well, what we were going to sort of do, is similar to what you lot did, but it kinda came out wrong.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1058] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1059] In the sense that, we wanted to categorise them, under things like, sex, race, religion whatever, and [...] colour code.
[1060] [laugh] [...] we're gonna be thinking about it beforehand, so, we can scrap that.
Martin (PS4T2) [1061] Right, [...] decided to do away with that, because what's happening here, is what I don't want you to do really, cos we've been, we've been through the stories, separately,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1062] Yeah.
Martin (PS4T2) [1063] Right, so I I actually don't want it, don't want you to do that again, we've looked at each story to see what it's about, so it's actually better to take the idea and erm, get get the stories and to write the idea.
[1064] Now actually, they do themselves down, because this is where they started, you see, can you talk about this one?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1065] Erm, we started off with [laugh] [...] was that, erm, we would just write down any word that came up to our head, in terms of relating it to the story [...] i.e. we thought about memories, and [...] memories [...] Erm, this is gonna match up with your [...] isn't it.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1066] Yeah.
Martin (PS4T2) [1067] [...] tell us what some of the ideas of, could you just quickly go through ... the areas that you identified.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1068] The areas?
Martin (PS4T2) [1069] Well people might like to write them down, if they haven't thought of them.
[1070] Well, sex seem to ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
Martin (PS4T2) [1071] quite large [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1072] [...] sex written three times up there.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1073] Erm, we've got sex and memories, women versus loneliness, [...] , erm race, class, relationships, religion ... erm ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1074] couples, motherhood, incest, marriage, sadness, relations, grief ... [...] that's what we think covers quite a few of the stories, don't we.
Martin (PS4T2) [1075] Yes, well, they haven't got round to it.
[1076] Let's, what you, Oh
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1077] Classified.
Martin (PS4T2) [1078] under those headings,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1079] Yeah.
Martin (PS4T2) [1080] Okay.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1081] We did try.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1082] Yeah, we did try, I think that's quite pretty.
Martin (PS4T2) [1083] Okay.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Martin (PS4T2) [1084] Having failed, just try again, you know, the spider syndrome. [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Martin (PS4T2) [1085] Right.
[1086] Have I got so many sheets of paper then, I need about six hundred people to erm,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1087] Yeah, we went through these stories, and tried to link all different things they go under, got attitudes, weight, sex, exploitation, memories, mother and child relationships, old fashioned settings, aspirations, working women, ageism, husband and wife, loneliness, change, working in middle upper classes, racism and grief, and then, we started again, through the stories giving numbers, and putting them under the headings we thought they came under, but the thing is, we've got a lot of them under all, well not all the headings, but a couple of the headings.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1088] A couple of the themes.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1089] Yeah, we haven't got rea like they've done, you know, just four.
Martin (PS4T2) [1090] Mm.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1091] But we're probably beginning to make ours smaller now.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1092] Mm.
Martin (PS4T2) [1093] Yeah, erm, I mean, I think, what you've, what you've actually done is identified quite a lot more areas than they, they had four, which which they did in in some detail, and they got the stories ... classified, erm, what you've actually thought of, is is far more areas, which I think's good, erm, and maybe other areas to consider as well.
[1094] Erm, what would be more useful if you could identify the stories, that are to to do with memories.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1095] A [...] count-down.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
Martin (PS4T2) [1096] They aren't chapters though, are they.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1097] Erm,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1098] It's Miss [...] Letters is the best one, erm, The New People, Summer Picnic.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1099] How did you get [...] to work though, did you just like.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1100] We had to [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1101] We all did it as part of an English lesson.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1102] But ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1103] Erm, what else have we got ... The Man Who Kept [...] Bus Station, and The Lone Survivor [...] memories.
Martin (PS4T2) [1104] Alright.
[1105] What have we got then as a mother, mother and child.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1106] July Ghost erm, Summer Picnic.
[1107] You know, sandwiches or whatever she just have, like, but it was kind of
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1108] She did have a mother.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1109] Oh shit.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1110] And then to, right, let's start doing that one.
Martin (PS4T2) [1111] Yes.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1112] Fall from grace.
Martin (PS4T2) [1113] This erm, old fashioned whatever it was, is is quite an interesting area I thought, erm, whether, it sounded old fashioned to start with, an old fashioned what.
[1114] Whether it was attitudes or setting or ... relevance to modern life, you know, to what extent are some of the stories ... relevant to their time and place, and not to our time and place, so that might be an interesting area to explore.
[1115] Erm, and to look at the stories which are of a different time ... but are still relevant to our time and place, they have a, have a message for us, even though they were set a hundred years ago, they've still got something to say us, so I think that's an area we need to to explore.
[1116] I certainly think that this is good in terms of, it gives you a a lot of areas, even if they don't necessarily identify the stories, so, if you're, sort of taking notes about which areas.
[1117] Yeah,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Martin (PS4T2) [1118] that's the abbreviation obviously, but if you're looking at the areas, I mean there is, er,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [clears throat]
Martin (PS4T2) [1119] I think you've identified a lot, obviously the husband and wife relationship, and obviously the men women which is, one you looked at.
[1120] Change, is an im er, as an important one, how, how different writers present change.
[1121] So, if you've got, sort of, three or four stories that you know, that you could deal with, the type of question you might get is, discuss how erm, different writers deal with the subject of change, with reference to probably about three stories.
[1122] Er, loneliness, I mean, a lot, so many of them deal with loneliness, you'd think that was a preoccupation of women short story writers, I think.
[1123] I can't see what's here, working oh, class, the class thing comes out.
[1124] Grief.
[1125] I suppose grief, loneliness, loss ... they're all interconnected, aren't they, so any one of those could come into it.
[1126] Morals, attitudes, again, there's a bit of a cross over there.
[1127] Sex, exploitation.
[1128] I think between you, I should think you've covered quite a lot of erm, of the areas there.
[1129] I mean, some and some of the issues are, perhaps not the main issue of the story, but er, are sort of peripheral, if I can use that word, on the, on the edge, like [...] identified weight as a problem, which a lot of middle aged women seem to encounter and get obsessed by it, but actually, the weight thing there, but the central thing is the relationship between the husband and wife, and the weight issue is sort of, I don't know, tied up with it, but it it wasn't the main issue.
[1130] Right, so that's a brief gallop the the various issues in the short stories, does anyone want to er, speak now, or for a long time, hold your peace.
[1131] Does anyone want to say anything ... on the subject.
[1132] Not gonna say anything for the microphone. [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Martin (PS4T2) [1133] Okay, then, erm, can I collect the pens up then, and erm, Wednesday, you're all going to write your assigned essay don't forget.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1134] Julie?
[1135] Have you got time to [...] somebody.
[1136] Essay on Wednesday?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...] [talk in background]
Martin (PS4T2) [1137] Right, the apostrophe.
[1138] Are you ready?
[1139] ... The apostrophe.
[1140] Right, the examiners at A Level ... expect, an A Level student to be able to use the apostrophe reliably and correctly, so let's just erm, go back to basics, with the apostrophe, as it seems to cause more confusion than, practically anything else.
[1141] When an apostrophe comes just before an s at the end of a word, it shows that something belongs to that word.
[1142] So you write the car's windscreen, The Sue's bike, and the King's head, it's it's an owner, plus possession, and the owner has the apostrophe of the thing that comes immediately afterwards.
[1143] Alright?
[1144] So if a word, the word, the cars, occur at the end of a sentence as in erm, I went to the showroom and saw the cars ... full stop.
[1145] There would be absolutely no u need to use an apostrophe because there's no possession to follow it, it's always got to be in that pattern of owner and possession, and if it's one, then it's before the s and if it's more than one, it's after the s.
[1146] So that covers the next point about plurals.
[1147] You don't add another s obviously, cats' cradles, rabbits' feets, divers' suits, are examples.
[1148] The exception, because there's always an exception to every rule.
[1149] If the plural word doesn't end in an s, you use the apostrophe and then you add an s, and these, I think, are the only, there are three, er, is men, women and children, because the singular form is man, changes to men, so is apostrophe s, the women the same, the children the same.
[1150] So that's the only place, I think, where you're going to find, where the word is a plural, the apostrophe comes before the s, is where the plural didn't end in an s.
[1151] Write the apostrophe and then the s ... and that's the only reason for putting an apostrophe before an s, or after an s at the, at the end of a word.
[1152] Now that's not every word, this is what happens when you start doing the apostrophe, that, there'll then be a spate of whenever you see a word ending in s, ah, word ending in s, use an apostrophe, regardless of whether you should use one or not, now you are a lovely [...] think about it.
[1153] If it's not in the owner possession pattern, then you don't use an apostrophe.
[1154] There are lots of words that end in s, and you don't need to use an apostrophe on them unless it's an owner.
[1155] Which, as a straightforward plural, is a straightforward plural and the cardinal sin is putting an apostrophe on a word which is a verb, which shows really you're not thinking about it.
[1156] You know, she sits by the window.
[1157] Well, what logic is gonna put an apostrophe on sits.
[1158] It's it's a verb.
[1159] You're only ever going to get an apostrophe on a noun.
[1160] You can't possibly have it on a verb, and that's another little rule you might like to think of, that you're only going to get the apostrophe on a noun, and you will never get an apostrophe on a pronoun.
[1161] So that why it's possessive.
[1162] Never has an apostrophe, it's only on a noun that you're going to do it, so, you could pick up sort of, just little, clues there as to , how to remember what you're doing.
[1163] Right, a little exercise for you.
[1164] Exercise one, put in apostrophes where they are needed in these sentences.
[1165] Okay, [...] sentences.
[1166] Think about it, though, don't just blindly put them on any word that ends in s, make sure you know why you're putting it there.
[1167] Okay.
[1168] One minute ... We're welcome to collaborate with the person next to you, you don't have to do it in splendid isolation. ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
(PS4T1) [1169] How are you doing, have you finished ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1170] No.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1171] No.
(PS4T1) [1172] the first group of four.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1173] No ...
(PS4T1) [1174] The sheep's intestines are causing people a lot of difficulty.
[1175] in number one, what have you erm put the apostrophe on.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1176] Erm, on athletes.
(PS4T1) [1177] Where?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1178] Between the e and the s at the end.
(PS4T1) [1179] Correct.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1180] And in between the t and the s on assistants.
(PS4T1) [1181] And that's the verdict of you all, is it?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1182] No.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1183] No.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Martin (PS4T2)
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1184] Should be an apostrophe over umpires as well.
Martin (PS4T2) [1185] There should be an apostrophe on umpires as well.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1186] So there should be one on assistants too.
Martin (PS4T2) [1187] Yes.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1188] Yeah.
Martin (PS4T2) [1189] Because it's the umpire's assistant,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1190] and it's the assistant's chair.
Martin (PS4T2) [1191] and the assistant's chair.
[1192] So it's the umpire's,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Martin (PS4T2) [1193] assistant's chair.
[1194] So I should think both of them were apostrophe before the ... so you got
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1195] Three.
Martin (PS4T2) [1196] How many of you got the three right in that one?
[1197] Is that all?
[1198] Right, erm, Martin, number two.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1199] Erm, well I just put one on friends, between the d and the s.
Martin (PS4T2) [1200] You put one between the d and the s of friends.
[1201] Yeah.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1202] Father's ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1203] It's father's as well.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Martin (PS4T2) [1204] Certainly I think fathers, as in my father's friend, yeah, and my father's friend's aunts, yes, so one, r and s of father's, in between the d and the s of friend's.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1205] And councils.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1206] And councils.
Martin (PS4T2) [1207] And you'd like one on, yes.
[1208] Where would you put in on councils.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1209] Between l and s.
Martin (PS4T2) [1210] Between the l and the s.
[1211] Tell me, has anyone got an apostrophe on aunts?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1212] No.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1213] No.
Martin (PS4T2) [1214] Shoot yourself.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1215] I have.
Martin (PS4T2) [1216] Shoot yourself.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1217] Between the t and the s.
Martin (PS4T2) [1218] On aunts?
[1219] Come on get your brain going,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1220] After the s.
Martin (PS4T2) [1221] what what's the possession that comes after aunts.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1222] After the s.
Martin (PS4T2) [1223] ?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1224] There ain't one aunt, is there?
Martin (PS4T2) [1225] No, there ain't one aunt.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1226] There ain't one
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1227] I know there ain't.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1228] Right.
Martin (PS4T2) [1229] Okay, so it's on father's friend's, and council's and on nothing else in that sentence.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1230] I'm not doing well.
Martin (PS4T2) [1231] Erm, Ella.
[1232] Number three.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1233] Erm, I put the apostrophes between n and s in stations.
Martin (PS4T2) [1234] Yeah, between the n and the s of stations.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1235] Mm, I put one after s in laboratorys.
Martin (PS4T2) [1236] You put one af after the s of laboratorys?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1237] Mm.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1238] No. [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Martin (PS4T2) [1239] Between the y and the s.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1240] Because if it was laboratories, it would be I E S.
Martin (PS4T2) [1241] I E S, yes.
[1242] If laboratories is plural, it would be I E S and you would have the apostrophe after the s then, but it's obviously singular, cos it ends in y so you put it after the y and the s.
[1243] And erm, Charlie!
[1244] The sausage skins
Jo (PS4T3) [1245] Oh yeah.
[1246] I put one between [...]
Martin (PS4T2) [1247] Pardon?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [imitating charlie's mumble]
Jo (PS4T3) [1248] I haven't done that one.
Martin (PS4T2) [1249] You haven't done that one.
Jo (PS4T3) [1250] No.
Martin (PS4T2) [1251] Well, would you like to have a go?
Jo (PS4T3) [1252] No. [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Jo (PS4T3) [1253] Put one between p and s on sheeps.
Martin (PS4T2) [1254] You'd like one between the p and the s of sheeps, yes, I would agree with you there.
Jo (PS4T3) [1255] Erm ... erm, the n and the s on skins.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1256] No.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1257] No.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1258] No.
Martin (PS4T2) [1259] Skin's what?
Jo (PS4T3) [1260] No.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
Martin (PS4T2) [1261] Skin's what, what's the word that follows it Charlie?
[1262] Are,
Jo (PS4T3) [1263] Skins are [...] [laugh]
Martin (PS4T2) [1264] It's not [...] you can't have it on skins. [...]
Jo (PS4T3) [1265] Mallards, then.
Martin (PS4T2) [1266] Yes, we'll have one on mallards, between the d and the s.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1267] Don't have to, though.
Martin (PS4T2) [1268] Pardon.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1269] It looks like, it could be a name, because Mallards could be the name of a company.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1270] [...] like.
Martin (PS4T2) [1271] Well [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1272] No, it's not.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1273] I mean, if the company was Mallard, then [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1274] In a Mallard [...] , but Mallards, you don't know, though, you start [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1275] [shouting] At the end. []
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1276] I think you should like, forget that one for a while, because that [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1277] But you can't [...] Mr Mallards, can you?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1278] Well, I did, I don't know, [...] I've crossed mine out, so I wasn't [...] you see,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1279] Oh, right.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1280] and you can see the crossing out there.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1281] We should have an enquiry, whether it's Mallard [...]
Martin (PS4T2) [1282] I don't think we need to type an enquiry, I think that the people who realise that, the fact that you had got there [...] is meant to indicate to you that name of the firm was Mallard, and therefore by using by using Mallards, sausage skins, they're expecting you to use apostrophe s.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [sigh]
Martin (PS4T2) [1283] Yeah.
[1284] Erm, and so that's all you need,
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Martin (PS4T2) [1285] Between the d and the s of Mallards, and the p and the s of sheeps.
[1286] Did anyone put, did anyone put apostrophe after the s of sheeps.
[1287] No.
[1288] Cos it's one of these words where the plural doesn't end in an s.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1289] Sh.
Martin (PS4T2) [1290] [...] Right, put your hands up ... if you got all of those right ...
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Martin (PS4T2) [1291] Okay.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1292] I would have got them all right except for
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [laugh]
Martin (PS4T2) [1293] Fine, right.
[1294] Now try the next s set of four then, and erm, see if you can er, improve your score.
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1295] I like the [...] second one, next one. [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1296] That's right .
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1297] It's they, if it's the same [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Martin (PS4T2) [1298] Would you, would you like to do a group collaboration on this one, because erm, can you come up with a version that your group agrees on?
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [1299] Yeah, that's true, Wendy [...]
Unknown speaker (JT4PSUNK) [...]