| PS1RG | X | m | (albert gunter, age unknown, minister) unspecified |
| KN7PS000 | X | u | (No name, age unknown) unspecified |
| KN7PSUNK (respondent W0000) | X | u | (Unknown speaker, age unknown) other |
| KN7PSUGP (respondent W000M) | X | u | (Group of unknown speakers, age unknown) other |
| albert gunter (PS1RG) |
[1] Over these erm past couple of weeks we've been looking at er some of the questions in the New Testament, we thought a couple of weeks back of the question that Jesus asked his disciples, do you think I'm able to do this ... and then last week we looked at a question that the disciples put to Jesus, that time when they came down from the mountain and they found the re , three of them came down with Jesus from the mountain of transfiguration and they found the other disciples with a man who and a, whose son was demon possessed and er they had been unable to help him and the man or brings his son to Jesus and Jesus delivers him and afterwards the disciples who had been so helpless put the question to Jesus, why could we not cast out this demon ... and this morning I'd like us to look at another question, we've got another one today and one God willing next week, er and the question is, is found in Luke chapter thirteen, let me just read a few verses, because of course it's, it's not just the questions, it's the answers that are important as well in Luke chapter thirteen, gonna read from verse twenty two it says [reading] in Jesus was passing through from one city and village to another, teaching and proceeding on his way to Jerusalem [] now that gives us a clue in that, because Jesus only ever went to Jerusalem apart from when he was a boy, he only ever went to Jerusalem once and that, after since that time, and that was when he was crucified, so Jesus was now on his way to Jerusalem, it was the latter days, the latter weeks of the life of Jesus, he was making his way now to Jerusalem and someone said to him [reading] Lord are there just a few who are being saved and Jesus said to hi , to them, strive to enter by the narrow door for many I tell you will seek to enter and will not be able, once the head of the house gets up and shuts the door and you begin to stand outside and knock on the door saying Lord open to us, then he will answer and say to you I do not know where you are from, then you will begin to say we ate and drank in your presence and you taught in our streets, and he will say I tell you I do not know where you are from, depart from me all you evil doers, there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth there, when you see Abraham and Isaac and Jacob and all the profits in the kingdom of God, but yourselves being cast out and they will come from East and West and from North and South and will recline at the table in the Kingdom of God, and behold some ar some are last who will be first and some are first who will be last [] , so it's just that question then, let's remind ourselves that is put to Jesus [reading] Lord are there just a few who are being saved [] ... |
| Unknown speaker (KN7PSUNK) | [...] |
| albert gunter (PS1RG) |
[2] now this particular question, this, it's a very solemn and searching question, it belongs to a group of three questions found in the New Testament which have to do with a matter of salvation, the first one is, we won't look up the reference and that for time this morning, the first one is the question that the disciples put to Jesus, who then can be saved, that's in Matthew, chapter nineteen, then there's this one in Luke thirteen, are there few that be saved and then that very, very personal question that was put not to Jesus but to Paul by the Philippinean jailer in act sixteen, what must I do to be saved, three questions in the new testaments about salvation, who then can be saved, are there few that be saved, what must I do to be saved, you know as Christians you possibly found yourself, asking yourself the, the same question that these people put to Jesus, why are there so few Christians, look about our own town, think of your own neighbourhood, your own street, think of the place where you work ... how few there are who are followers of Jesus Christ, how few there are who have committed themselves to Jesus Christ to of receive him as their saviour, who've have accepted him as saviour, how few there are when you compare it er to all the others who are rejecting him and er who are living their life regardless, how true it is that the great majority of people seem in, in this present day to have little time for God or for the things of God, they've got time for all sorts of other things, but God and his claim on their life is crowded out, how many there are like that, how few there are who have submitted to Jesus Christ and have received him as their saviour or so it seems. [3] ... And our Lord in the words that we've read gives a very solemn answer to that question in the, in those words that we read a few moments ago and his immediate answer to the question you know are there few that be saved, was to say many, this was in the following verse, many shall not be able to be saved, now does that mean that only a few will be saved, that there's only a few people who are gonna be in heaven that Jesus Christ came and died on the cross for about a handful of people, a small percentage does that what it, is that what it means, well lets look and see what the bible has to say, in Matthew chapter seven in verse thirteen and verse fourteen, this is what Jesus says [reading] enter by the narrow gate for the gate is wide and the way is broad that leads to destruction and many of those who enter by it, for the gate is small and the way is narrow that leads to life, but few of those who find it [] ... any way in the same book, in, in Matthew in, in, in chapter twenty two and in, in, in verse fourteen, listen again to what it says there ... Jesus is speaking he says [reading] for many a called, but few are chosen [] ... |
| Unknown speaker (KN7PSUNK) | [...] |
| albert gunter (PS1RG) |
[4] but when we've read those we've got to look up what else Jesus said, remember a few months ago the passage we read from Luke thirteen [reading] and they will come from the East and the West and from the North and the South and will recline at the table in the Kingdom of God [] , they will come he says from all directions, we work and hold and these two scriptures intention, we've gotta compare one with the other, then we'll read also John in that tremendous vision in the book of revelation he would he says what he saw there, in chapter seven verse nine after these things I looked and behold a great multitude which no one could count from every nation and all tribes and peoples and tongues standing before the throne and before the lamb, clothe in white robes and palm branches were in their hands and they cried out with a loud voice saying salvation to our God who sits on the throne and to the lamb, a handful of people, tiny minority, John says it was a great number, a multitude which no one could count from every nation, from every ethnic group, from every tribe and, and, and, and race on the face of the earth there in God's heaven ... how grateful you and I should be, if we are among that number, it's God's grace, it's not that we've deserved it, it's not that we have been privileged by some genetic er process to have been born in a so called a nominally Christian country, it is all of God's grace, it's not what we have done or what we are, but we have been saved by his grace and just for a few moments this morning, I'd like us to from this question that was put to Jesus to follow on and if you like get five propositions from it, it sounds complicated but it's not. [5] Few there be, are there few that be saved, well what does the bible say about this, first of all it teaches abundantly clearly that all may be saved, God is not partial, God has no favourites, he doesn't love you more than he loves any body else, he doesn't love me more than he loves you or you more than me, he doesn't love you more than he loves ah any other racial group or any other ethnic group, he loves us all the same God so loved the world that he gave his only son Jesus Christ, here in his love, not that we love God says the apostle but that he loved us, the old testament profit reminds us that he has loved us with an ever lasting love, who, this was one of the hang ups that the Jewish nation had, they thought that they were the cats whiskers, he chose them, but he in fact didn't love them any more than he loved the, the hitites, the parasites, the gergasites and all the other ites, he loved them all the same, God is not partial in his love because he is love, if there was any body that God did not love he would actually cease to be God because love is not something that, that God does, you and I do it no matter how loving you are, or how loving you think you are, you are not love, you choose to love somebody and you love them, there are times when that love goes very thin sometimes, perhaps because of events that have happened, it can actually come to an end where that love dies, you withdraw your love ... God can't do that, God loves us as we've said with an eternal love, a love that will go on throughout the endless ages of eternity ... |
| Unknown speaker (KN7PSUNK) | [...] |
| albert gunter (PS1RG) |
[6] and it will not in that sense make any difference to God love, make a lot of difference to you and to me, but it will not make any difference to God's love whether we spend our eternity in heaven or in hell, he will not love those in heaven any more than he loves those who are already, who will be punished for ever in hell, because God's love is eternal, it didn't start at Bethlehem, it didn't start at Calvary and it doesn't end when you and I die, as love is eternal, so God has provided salvation for every body and he offers salvation to all who will come to him in repent and and seine fe and except his salvation, you see when the Lord Jesus Christ died upon Calvary's cross he died to make salvation available for who, for every body, you see he didn't just lay your sins on Jesus, listen to what the old testament profit Isaiah says, there in that tremendous fifty third chapter, and, and in what it's in verse six, [reading] all of us says the profit like sheep have gone astray, each of us has turn to his own way, but the Lord has caused the iniquity of us all to fall on him [] , whether you and I reject Jesus Christ or accept him does not alter the fact that our sin was laid on Jesus ... the sins are the most awful person you can think of ... were laid on Jesus Christ, Jesus Christ paid the sins for, for, for, for men like Hitler, he paid theirs, the price for their sins, as much as he paid the price for the sins of somebody like St Francis of Assisi ... So God is not partial, it's clear from scripture that all maybe saved, he made salvation available to all ... in that same book of Isaiah in chapter forty five, verse twenty two, it says look unto me all the ends of the earth are being saved said the Lord, in Romans one sixteen Paul says I am not ashamed of the gospel because it is the power of God onto salvation to all who will believe, and the verse we've already quoted John three sixty, for God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son, that who so ever believe in him should not perish, but have ever lasting life and Paul when writing to Timothy says he gives his own personal testimony he says this is a good and a faithful saying, it's worthy of every body accepting that God desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth, so it's quite clear that all maybe saved. [7] The bible closes there in Revelation chapter twenty two with that invitation, an invitation to a select you know, an invitation to all, there almost in the, in the last few verses, verse seventeen, the spirit and the bride say what come and let the one who hears say come and let the one who is thirsty come and let the one who wishes take the water of life without cost, the invitation is to all, so it's quite clear that all maybe saved, but it's equally clear, a second proposition that all will not be saved ... |
| Unknown speaker (KN7PSUNK) | [...] |
| albert gunter (PS1RG) |
[8] and this is a solemn's teaching of God's word, the bible nowhere teaches the doctrine of universalism, that everybody's gonna go to heaven, it doesn't teach that, it doesn't say and it does not teach that ultimately every body will be saved, there are plenty of those around who'd teach that today, but the bible doesn't teach that ... there are those who will tell us that the sinner and the saint, the man who has no thought of God or no love for God and the Christian that all be gathered together on the final day, you all have another chance, Jesus never said that, the bible doesn't teach that, it's quite unscriptural. [9] Look what Jesus says here in Luke chapter thirteen, in verse twenty four, just let me pick a few phrases out, verse twenty four it says [reading] shall not be able [] in verse twenty five there was their cry [reading] Lord open to us [] and in verse twenty seven their response [reading] depart from me [] the result in verse twenty eight [reading] there was gonna be weeping [] it wasn't gonna be universal, they were not all gonna be saved, they were not all just gonna be swept in in the last day and didn't really matter, you're all buddies together now in heaven, not at all, this surely what Jesus says here makes it very clear that all will not be saved ... if at first we've already mentioned in John er no sorry verse further on in John three this done verse thirty six [reading] he who believes in the son has eternal life, but he who does not obey the son shall not see life but the wrath of God abides upon him [] , there's no suggestion there of being ultimately brought in to God's heaven and ultimately being saved, no it is the wrath of God abideth upon that person. [10] One could go on and pick many other scriptures, you know in the erm the New Testament not only were there those three questions that we mentioned earlier on about salvation, but there are three unanswered questions in the New Testament ... in Mark chapter eight, Jesus asked that question of which there is no answer, [reading] for what shall it profit a man if he gains the whole world and looses his sole [] or [reading] what shall a man or a woman give in exchange for their soul [] , Jesus didn't try and answer, there is no answer to that question, then again in, in Hebrews chapter three, er chapter two and verse three there is an unanswered question, [reading] how shall we escape if we neglect so greater salvation [] , and finally one other the apostle Peter, he asked the question in, in chapter fo , first apostle in chapter four and verse seven ... seventeen [reading] for it is time for judgment to begin with the household of God and if judgment begins with us first, what will be the outcome for those who do not obey the gospel of God [] |
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| albert gunter (PS1RG) |
[11] again there is no answer to that question, simply because the answer is so horrific, it doesn't bear thinking about, but thank God all maybe safe, all will not be safe, but all maybe safe, God has provided a salvation that is available to all and if we are not safe it is because we choose to reject his s , his offers of mercy, so we thank God that all may be safe, but the solemn fact remains is that all will not be saved, well that leads us on to, to this third proposition, not only ... that the bible teach that all maybe saved, not only does it teach that all will not be saved, but it is quite clear that some will be saved whom we did not expect to be saved, we can be quite sure about that because judgment doesn't rest with us, way back Abraham says perhaps one of the most important statements in his life when he said there in, in, in Genesis chapter eighteen and we actually sang the wo tho the quotation in the song we just sang a few moments ago where he says will not the judge of all the earth be right, judgement is not yours and mine, that's God's prerogative ... and the other song that we've been, the song that we've been singing, that song by faber there's a wideness in God's mercy ... lets be honest we are so narrow with our mercy, our gra , our expressions of grace is so limited, but there's a wideness in God's mercy and faber says it's got the wideness of the sea, there's a kindness in his justice, which is more than liberty, David knew all about that when he was given the option, he said oh I'd rather fall into the hands of God than into the hands of men, I'd rather that God dealt with me than that my fellow man dealt with me, because with him there's mercy, with him there's grace, with him there is, there is long suffering and there's compa compassion and there's love, and faber goes on with the love of God is broader than the measure of man's mind and the heart of the eternal is most wonderfully kind, now that's all very well for the song writer to say that in a hymn and it sounds nice and it's, it sounds good but is there a scriptural authority for this, is it really true, or is it just a nice song that we sing with, it does us good because we feel it's a nice, there nice thoughts, well, surely we have it in the passage we've been reading that there is ... there is a mercy with God, there is a kindness with God in ver in verse thirty of that chapter [reading] behold some who are last will be first and some who are first will be last [] it's quite clear that some will be saved that we did not expect to be saved, and you can find example after example of this, it was a tremendous surprise to the onlookers when a very sinful woman annoyed to the feed of Jesus, it was a tremendous surprise to the Pharisee who rejected God, although he was such a good man, to find that the, er sorry to be rejected by God although he was a good honest upright man, and to find that the sinner was accepted by God, it was a tremendous surprise to the people when Zacchaeus who named you to be a sinner, an open twist there an evil man was saved by the Lord Jesus, you could save salvation has come to this house, it was a tremendous surprise when the law breaker who was dying on the cross beside the law Jesus was saved and went to be with him, with the Lord in paradise, it was a tremendous surprise to the disciples when Jesus preached the gospel and revealed himself to a gentile woman, who was an adulterer seven times over ... but he did and she was saved, it was a tremendous surprise to Ananias when the Lord revealed himself to |
| Unknown speaker (KN7PSUNK) | [...] |
| albert gunter (PS1RG) |
[12] on the road to Damascus and saved him, but he did, it was a tremendous surprise to the Apostle Paul that the Lord had saved him at all, he never got over it, he called himself the chief of sinners, but God's grace, God's mercy had been revealed to him, you and I when we get to heaven are in for a few surprises, the grace, the mercy of God is far broader and wider than our imagination, we'll meet a lot of folk there that we didn't expect to see ... that leads me to a fourth proposition, not only will some be saved that we did not expect to be saved, but it's clear that others will not be saved who expected to be saved ... there's a passage in Luke thirteen, verses twenty five, let me read them again [reading] one the head of the house gets up and shuts the door you begin to stand outside and knock on the door saying Lord open up to us and then he will answer and say to you I do not know where you're from, then you'll begin to say we ate and drank in your presence, you taught in our streets, we know you Lord, we rubbed shoulders with you, we went to church, we experience those things, we knew the answers to the re to the questions ... but he will say I tell you I did not know where you are from, depart from me all you evil doers [] ... those words make it quite clear, here, there's words of Jesus, there's references to those who profess, to know the Lord Jesus Christ, but who do not in fact know him at all , they know bits and pieces about him, they've seen him, you know it's in its immediate context, they had seen him in the street, they had heard his teaching, there maybe those who had been fed by the, by the miraculous er multiplying of the loafs and the fishes, they had seen the miracle, some of them may have been healed by Jesus, they knew lots about him but they did not know him and he says I do not know you ... how many folk there are like this, they expect to be saved, perhaps because they go to church, perhaps because they've got Christian parents, perhaps because they read their bible, perhaps because occasionally when they're in trouble they prayer, they've been confirmed, they've been baptized, that, that they're good, they're honest, they're not rogues, they wouldn't do a, a, a bad turn to somebody, not deliberately, they're nice people ... but they, they don't know the truth of what it says in God's word, they don't know the truth of Romans three and verse twenty because by the works of the Lord no flesh will be justified in his sight for through the law comes the knowledge of sin, doesn't come the forgiveness of it, they don't know the truth of Ephesians chapter two verses eight and nine for by grace you've been saved through faith and that not of yourselves it's the gift of God, not as a result of works that no one should boast, for we are his workmanship created in Christ Jesus for good works which God prepared before hand that we should walk in them, they don't know the truth of er, er of Titus, chapter three and, and verse five ... where, where the apostle Paul says there, [reading] he saved us not on the basis of deeds which we have done in righteousness, but according to his mercy [] , how tragic it is to expect to be saved, to think you're going to heaven ... and in the end to find that you're not saved ... and Jesus says they'll be many like that in that day. [13] On that final day there will be many like that, little earlier on in the book of Titus in the first chapter Paul says in verse sixteen [reading] they profess to no God, but by their deed they deny him [] |
| Unknown speaker (KN7PSUNK) | [...] |
| albert gunter (PS1RG) |
[14] and all of this leads natural to the final fifth proposition ... not only does the bible teach that all may be saved, not only does it teach that however that not all will be saved, not only is it true and clear that some will be saved and we do not, do not, do not expect to be saved, not only is it quite clear that others will not be saved, who we expected to be saved, but finally it is quite clear that no one will be saved except by God's way, and God's way of salvation is very simply by repentance and faced. [15] We have already read some words from Isaiah, let me just turn you back to Isaiah again, this time to chapter fifty five, verses six and seven. [16] [reading] Seek the Lord while he may be found, call upon him while he is near, let the wicked forsake his way and the unrighteous man is thoughts and let them return to the Lord, for what's gonna happen, for he will of compassion on him and to our God for he will abundantly pardon [] ... those words were very quoted from Acts, chapter sixteen, when that Philippine jailer said Lord what must I do, sir what must I do to be saved and there Paul timac believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and thou shalt be saved this is God's way by repentance in faith that's presented in Jesus, he is the only saviour, not your works, not my works, not our good deeds, not our religious observances, he is the only saviour, did he not say himself I am the way the truth and the life, nobody comes to the father but by me. [17] Not only is Jesus the only saviour but he's also a presence saviour not for the future or the passed, but he is there now and he says now, Paul to the Corinthians now is the acceptable time, now is the day of salvation, not to be put off, not to wait until you're older until this is settled and till that's done and you've had this experience or that experience, now is the accepted time, he is the presence saviour, he is not a saviour for you tomorrow, you don't know what tomorrow will bring but he is a saviour for the present for now, also he is a complete saviour in Hebrews seven twenty five [reading] he is able to save forever, those who draw near to God since he always lives to make intercession for them [] and finally not only is he a complete saviour, but he will actually save you, not the person beside you, don't worry about that he will actually save you, there in Romans chapter ten, thirteen, [reading] for whoever, for whoever will call upon the name of the Lord will be saved [] and so the invitation's to you and it's to me, it's to us as individuals, are there a few that's gonna be saved. [18] In a sense that's not the real question, that's not the important question, the really important question as far as I'm concerned is will I be served and as far as your concerned, will you or are you saved, well it's, it's up to you, it's up to me because he will save you, forever who will call upon the name of the Lord will be saved. [19] Let's close shall we with a song of, of commitment really, it's number four hundred in the er songs of fellowship and were gonna sing it to the first tune, oh ... call for us I believe, but let's look at it again. |
| (KN7PS000) |
[20] We know also the son of God has come and has given us understanding so that we may know him who is true and we are |
| Unknown speaker (KN7PSUNK) | [...] |
| (KN7PS000) |
[21] even in his son Jesus Christ, he is the true God and eternal life. |
| albert gunter (PS1RG) |
[22] Right that's it, fine. [23] Let me just give you a little illustration that might help, you know in thinking of the erm ... the fusion of the divinity, the divine nature and the human nature, erm is it Clarke Kent, is that the guys name on television, you know the character, you know the guy that walks around you know he's the boy next door type figure with glasses and all the rest of it, he's no macho figure that and then in a transformation take place and woof goes flying through the air doesn't he, what is he, he's Batman isn't he |
| (KN7PS000) |
[24] Superman |
| albert gunter (PS1RG) |
[25] Superman is I don't know erm, well same difference any way, but you see this is it, he's not, you know, in that story, in that, in, in, in, in that sort of nonsense thing, he is not the same character at both times, he hasn't got, when he's walking along the street as Clarke Kent he hasn't got the ability to whoosh through the air as Superman ... he's Clarke Kent, not so Jesus, he wasn't ... Jesus divine one moment, Jesus human the other but they were perfectly married at all time from his, from the time he was, he's conception took place, so he wasn't one thing one moment, you know and one thing the next, but there it was a perfect marriage if you like, the two, I was gonna say becoming one so that they were invisible, you couldn't say of that's it that's the human nature of Jesus, that's his diviner it ju , because the two were perfectly married, they were fused together so they really they became one. [26] A couple more re verses er in Two Corinthians, five fifteen, and one John chapter two and verse two. ... |
| (KN7PS000) |
[27] And as you die broad that they wish |
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| albert gunter (PS1RG) |
[28] Right so, you know, there are those who would teach that Jesus he would die for our sins and he's forgiven us sins, but only those who come to him, Jesus died for the sin of the whole world, for every man, woman, boy and girl that has ever lived ... or ever will live, he died for the sin of the whole world, not just for those even who lived after his death, that's why it talks about in the Old Testament people like Abraham looking for that day, and so Jesus who in, when he died, because he's eternal, so we've got the problems with time, God hasn't got problems with time, he's eternal and so his sacrifice, the sacrifice of him on the cross was effective for Abraham as it is for you, it was as effective for David as it was for Paul ... otherwise Abraham would never of had his sins forgiven because what happened with all the sacrifice with all the little lambs that were killed and all the goats and all the rest they only acted as a covering for sin, didn't take them away, it covered them, what for, until the moment when Jesus would come and would take those sins away and so ... when you think of David's sin, his adultery and his murder, how does he get forgiven for that because Jesus died from the cross and he takes upon himself David's sin and he takes upon him Abraham's sin and Noah's sin and Adam's sin, just as much as your sin and the person who will be born in ten years time their sin also, all our sins er as Gloria just read there from, from one John to two they were all of him he has died for every one, well that's his humiliation, hurry along quickly now his exhortation, the period from Jesus's resurrection onward is referred to as to the, as the state of exhortation, now what does that term mean, well as Jesus according to his divine nature has always been, he was always every where, now in his human nature, before,be , sorry it's not, it's not on that one, but before he, he came to earth, he was every where, he was God, he was, he was omnia present that means he was every where at the same time, but he takes upon himself he's su , he's, he's human nature and he takes upon himself the limitations and when Jesus is walking down second avenue in, in Jerusalem he's not in Nazareth ... that's why there were times when people came to er, to, to, came rushing out because they heard that Jesus was passing by, see he wasn't there resident with them, he passed by, now he's gone back to heaven and where is he, he's in heaven, he, er whereabouts, where do you think Jesus is now, that resurrected body that was glorified that has gone back to heaven, where do you think it is |
| Unknown speaker (KN7PSUNK) |
[29] Gone back to the Lord ain't he. |
| albert gunter (PS1RG) |
[30] well let's read, Ephesians one, nineteen to twenty three, somebody's got that, let's read that bit ... |
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| albert gunter (PS1RG) |
[31] right, so, he is there as er Jean er has read to us, seated at the, at the father's right hand, he's there on the throne, but Paul also says, talks about erm in the last verse there which is his body the fullness of, [reading] the fullness of him through Jesus who feels all in all, by the holy spirit although the glorified resurrected body of Jesus is on the throne, by the holy spirit he is everywhere [] , that's why he's with you and he's with me and he's with a folk in Timbuktu and in Honolulu, he is every where ... by the holy spirit, so now thinking of his exhortation again, as the God man, Jesus now fully and always makes use of the divine powers and attributes that are his, all power belongs to him and it's because that he says to his disciples you're to go into all the world and I am with you because all power is mine, all power, all authority is given onto me, therefore says Jesus, because of that you can go because you're going in my strength and in my authority. [32] Has somebody got Matthew twenty eight, verses nineteen and twenty? ... |
| Unknown speaker (KN7PSUNK) |
[33] [reading] Go there all people, every where and make them |
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| Unknown speaker (KN7PSUNK) |
[34] and teach them to obey every thing that I've commanded you and I will be with you always to the end of [...] [] |
| albert gunter (PS1RG) |
[35] Right, I've just got a, two or three minutes, I've just wanna get something quickly done before we, we close and I'm not gonna look up all the references, because your get them for next week any way in, in the house group, but, now, now in a sense it's difficult to understand to take all this in after all his God and were people, how do we understand Jesus, it's, it's difficult, however knowing something about them does help us to understand something important, it helps us to understand what happened when Jesus ascended, when he went back to heaven, you see when Jesus arose from the earth the, the disciples who watch him it says there in Acts chapter one, they saw him go up in to the heaven, up into you know in a cloud, have you ever thought what that really means ... what on earth was it, they saw him go up in a cloud, can you image a sort of great clouds coming and dropping down over the mountain top there and was suddenly whisking Jesus up and then watching Jesus going up in this cloud into the sky, I don't really think it was quite like that, have you ever wonder why it was that Jesus went up in a cloud, you see what was he doing, he wasn't beginning a journey to some far off place in the universe, some distant corner where God the father was, he wasn't doing that at all, what do you think a cloud can you, give any suggestions of what a cloud might represent because very often a lot of some of the language in the bible is picture language and it, it, it speaks as something else, what do, what do you think a cloud, does any body have suggestions of what a cloud might speak to us about, or speak to us of, sorry, power yeah, any thing else |
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| albert gunter (PS1RG) |
[36] no hang on that, no, no, yeah, what is it just the thing of the moment about cloud, what does it, what does a cloud represent, Ben suggested power, any thing else |
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| albert gunter (PS1RG) |
[37] vapour, rain, any thing else ... |
| Unknown speaker (KN7PSUNK) | [...] |
| albert gunter (PS1RG) |
[38] aha |
| Unknown speaker (KN7PSUNK) | [...] |
| albert gunter (PS1RG) |
[39] yeah, well let me just read you two or three verses from Exodus, chapter forty, this is what it says [reading] then the cloud covered the tent of meeting and the glory of the Lord filled the tabernacle and Moses was not able to enter the tent of meeting because the cloud had settled on it and the glory of the Lord filled the tabernacle and throughout all their journeys whenever the cloud was taken up from over the tabernacle the sons of Israel would set out, but if the cloud was not taken up then they did not set out until the day that it was taken up, for throughout all their journeys the cloud of the Lord was on the tabernacle by day and there was fire in it by night, in the sight of all the house in Israel [] and if you were to turn over to kings you've got a, you've got a similar thing there with the dedication of the temple and as Be Ben was saying the power really it's the it's the presence of God, the shine, the glory, that cloud of, and so what, what, what catches the Lord Jesus up is really the glory of God here he is, the, the riseness, the glorified Christ being called up into heaven in the, in the glory, what he's been glorified, so he withdraws his physical, physical presence from one place here on earth to present there on the throne and yet by the holy spirit to be every where ... now Jesus then, he didn't cease to be truly man at either his resurrection or at his ascension, he stays man, God, the God man all the way through ... and it's still true today he is the God man today and that's important for you and me, think of the very worse experience that you have ever had in your life, think of the very worse experience that could happen to you, with the exception of you know that of, of say total failure of some awful sin, the worse thing, maybe a loss of someone dear to you, someone very close to you, er, er, a bereavement, the most awful experience you have had ... well ... he has gone through, he has known that experience, he has, has tempted in all points like as we are ... he knows our frame, he remembers were dust and he has been there and it is a man who has experienced those same experiences that you and I experience day by day, year after year, it is a man who has gone that, who has walked that path, who is in heaven interceding and praying for us, we'll stop there cos time has gone ... erm we'll stop there, we won't go on otherwise I'll get into trouble [laugh] ... During this past month some of the questions in the New Testament, the first one we looked at you remember was that question that Jesus asked of his disciples, do you believe that I am able to do this, then we looked at a question which the disciples asked of Jesus, why could we not cast it out ... last week we looked at another question, are only a few people going to be saved ... and this morning I'd like us it's the final one of these questions not that there aren't other questions in the New Testament and scores, scores of others but were just looking at four er throughout this month, I'd like us to look this morning for one at, for a few minutes, at one that Jesus asked of a man who confronted him, I'd like to read a few verses from Luke chapter eighteen, Luke chapter eighteen ... I'm gonna read from verse thirty five, it's the well known account of blind Bartimaeus, Luke chapter eighteen and verse thirty five [reading] and he came about that as Jesus was approaching Jericho a certain blind man was sitting by the road begging, now hearing a multitude going by he began to inquire |